Sony Doesn't Want Your Money

He can't review the Tv with out Sony's permission to use it in a public pay publication.

I have a Toshiba 65" DLP 1080p and, in my opinion, it blows away anything Sony has. Not because of the size, but the picture of it is just awesome. F**k Sony anways, its rhymes with pony and ponies are gay. So just keep reviewing TVs worth reviewing, not overpriced, mediocre sonys. 360!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Apollo:

Free TVs? Where do you get those? Every set we review comes with a loan agreement – a contract that specifies how long we have the TV for evaluation and on which date the manufacturer expects that set back. We don’t keep the TVs we review, and at no time have we ever stated that we did. (In fact, once, in transit, one got damaged, and we had to pay for it, as you would expect – but there, all we owned was the mistake, and not the set itself.) If you don’t mind me asking, where did the concept of “OXM just wants a free TV” come from?

What’s more, I’m not interested in using my personal set because I don’t usually review the sets myself. I am the section editor, which means that I schedule the coverage, make sure we have the sets, and edit the copy – but usually, Ryan or one of our freelancers (Dave Murphy) takes the physical set home and puts it through its paces. Sometimes those paces take a good week, because they throw a lot of different games and movies and calibration stuff at them.

I did consider reviewing my set, but I didn’t really want to be without a TV for a week or two, plus if I’ve already bought it for my own personal use…wouldn’t THAT make me biased? Certainly if I’ve been using it for a month, I’d be predisposed to like it, because I paid my personal money for it. It works for Amazon reviews, sure, but OXM is approaching hardware reviews from a different, more detached perspective.

I regret that I was so catty in the article, but I still disagree with Sony’s logic on this one. PS3 has nothing to lose by sending us a set for review – ahem, one they’d get back, or we’d buy if it were damaged in our use – and our offer is open. All the companies we met with at CES were very warm to the idea of sending us loaner sets for review. Sony is welcome to submit a set for review as well.

So Sony wouldn't send you a free TV... and that's it? You're done? You OWN the TV, Dan -- review it!

Newspapers, which are about as close to real journalism as you can find these days, are starting to refuse free tickets to the baseball games they cover out of the fear that it might affect their impartiality. And you expect a free television? C'mon now.

I'm not sure how you can even expect to give a fair review to a model provided by the manufacturer anyway. If there is severe clouding on 99 percent of the units, guess what? You're not going to find it, because they're going to send you the one that works. If you want to give an impartial review to an HDTV, you have to buy it off the shelf, and that's that. Heck, you can even return it later if you need to.

With all the concerns right now about game magazines being under the influence of publisher money, I am amazed that you are actually bashing a company on your website for not sending you free stuff. Regardless of their reasons, you lost a lot of credibility in my eyes.

Sony could not care less about any of our opinions.They are gonna sell a ton of tvs anyhow because they are a superior product.So.....next topic please.

Sounds like someone just doesn't like Sony. I have both the PS3 and XBOX360, but my TV is a VIZIO 42 inch LCD 1080p. The Sony TV people are in business to make money, and not help the competition make money. How can you say that they don't want our money. There are so many good TVs out there, so just move on and find something else to blog about that is relevant to our XBOX360 gaming euphoria.

I own the 360, the PS3, and the Wii. Sony is the most arrogant company of the 3 and I hope they sink deep.
However, I must say Sony's hardware is the best. Their HDTV is more expensive for the dollar but they are top notch. The PS3 is plainly a superior machine in terms of technology. However, Microsoft support is better (They reimburse for the ring of death). The Wii is most unique.

I respect your opinion but I believe you are wrong here. Sony has the right to turn down anyone they want, and I believe they turned you down because you wanted to keep it. Also, I don't think it had anything to do with PlayStation 3 minus sister company. And third, it is in fact a tad childish and harsh to add the hook as this post "Sony doesn't want your money." Just because they didn't want to have a TV of their's reviewed doesn't have anything to do with the console wars. Thank you for taking the time to read this post.

Are you all dense? This post proves that Sony had valid suspicions about whether OXM would be able to conduct itself professionally. Now you could say "but he has the TV in question" but that doesn't matter. He could have just said "fine, they won't send me a TV to review, I can review my own" or perhaps just not reviewed this model in question and gone on to review another brand with no mention of this but he didn't. As a result this entire post seems unprofessional, spiteful, and most importantly it seems so very fanboyish. Mr. Amrich just proved Sony was perfectly valid in thinking that perhaps the magazine is not one it should associate itself with. I don't read OXM, I tend to avoid any source of gaming news that focuses on just one platform (with the exception of PC Gamer) as there tends to be a certain, and very obvious, bias. This rant shows me that my opinion is valid.
You can go back to talking about how childish Sony is if you want, just realize that this rant is way more childish than Sony's suspicions concerning OXM's reliability.

What the hell is with all the Sony fanboys. This topic has nothing to do with the gaming consoles. A TV is just that, not a gaming system. Sony should stop whining about how little profit they are making on the PS3 - and GROW UP!

I agree with the person that said to just by an AQUOS. My 32" 1080p LCD set kicks some bootay. Screw Sony.

This is what people are failing to grasp...PS3 is CENTRAL to Sony's future strategy. The company has to win the BR/HDDVD war to ensure future success. If this turns into a protracted even with HDDVD gaining 50% market share, Sony will be in ALOT of trouble. They will have to PAY lots of money to studios to keep them from bolting to dual format, and given the heavy losses on each and every PS3 console...that would seriously damage the company's future. As the first non-Japanese to ru nthe company, Stringer knows his azz is on the line to get fired quick, and by next summer, if they aren't dominating, you can expect some pink slips.

Gee, I dunno, but MAYBE it has something to do with Sony discontinuing the SXRD line of Bravias. Since the official word isn't out they may not want to just come out and say, "Sorry, we're killing this line."

The article doesn't mention the specific model so you can't no for sure, but if it was one of the SXRDs, I wouldn't be surprised if that was the reason.

Wow...what a bunch of Shityits. Buy an Aquos, it renders stunning graphics on the 360, and its cheeper as well.

~StrikerCrash

If I were a Sony exec and reading this article, I'd be looking for someone to fire! Care to name the person with whom you were in contact at Sony who told you these things, or would that open a legal can of worms?
I love to watch fools suffer their just due.
Thanks,
Howard

That makes no sense, but you have to lie in the bed you make I guess.

wow thats crazy man i remember when video games were just fun now its some huge marketing war its crazy but hey the good games keep comin so im not hatin

If Sony doesn't want my money, fine! I can still kill Locust just as easy and pretty on another HDTV!

Oh, look at this. I believe that is the reason why Sony wouldn't let you review their TVs.

It's still dumb for them to do it, though.

I am an avid 360 gamer and it is Sony's misfortune that I just happen to have a Sony Bravia HDTV. OOPS! If only I had known! Perhaps I should ask Sony for a refund and then take my business to Toshiba or even Magnavox? I can't deny that the picture is incredible. I am completly hooked. I got my Bravia a year ago and from the start, I was very impressed. Why would Sony do such a foolish thing? Oh yeah, they're so rich that they don't need Xbox 360 gamer's business. What a rip! Keep up the smart decisions Sony.
I'm sure that the other gaming system players will pick up the slack.

Until recently, I have always been a huge supporter of Sony AV equipment, as they have lead the television and stereo markets, including their upper level Stereo Equipment (Nakamichi). About a year ago I bought an Sony 60" SXRD, which experienced the equivilent of the red ring of death. The light ballast has an inheirent defect, that Sony has not backed up with their warranty, and tried to skate around the problem. I then had to purchase an extended warranty (at $600.00), after paying $5000.00 + for the tv. Now I am part of a class action lawsuit, that is forcing Sony to extend it's warranty to 2009 on the ballast, and to replace tv's that have had more than one issue with the light ballast, and to pay back persons that purchased extended warranties.

I'm sure the Bravia is a fine television, but I will never purchase another Sony product based on the run around I was given by numerous Sony representitives, over several months. I have slowly began replacing Sony products, including cameras, laptop, dvd player etc.... A new Samsung television now graces my bedroom, but the albatross of a Sony still sits in my living room. Granted they have great pictures, when they work. When it fails, it will be replaced by another companies model.

I'm not loyal to any particular console, and have owned most all consoles over the last 20 years, including Phillips CD-i, Artari Jaguar (which people complained about how big the controller was, but if you add the message qwerty board to the Controller S it's roughly the same size and shape), and the 3DO (Thanks Trip Hawkins for that expensive item). I have not shunned the PS3 for the reason of the TV problems, but because it has yet to have a credible 1st party release or exclusive (in a genre that I play) that I deem worthwhile to even consider purchase one.

Sony has to answer to stock holders. Which I can not imagine that the stock holders care about the console war, but care about the bottom line, which by Sony refusing to have their TV reviewed by a "warring" console magazine, would prohibit sales, thus effecting their bottom line. Not the smartest move. I have lost confidence in Sony as a company completely.

The sheer number of responses here says that this is a hot topic (or that people like me have too much time on our hands). Any-whooo... The fact is that there are many people who own more than one console for various reasons. I had the PS, PS2, X-Box, SNES, and Cube. I now have an X-Box 360 and am waiting for a valid reason to own the PS3. Right now, it's not exclusive games, because that's definitely owned-and-operated by the 360, but that day may come. The Blue-Ray is definitely worth looking into, but I've looked more at the stand-alone systems for that option. Besides, I like to be a late adopter and let the early birds pay for development costs.

Sony has screwed up in the past, and they continue to make grave mistakes. Does anyone remember a video tape format called "Betamax"? That was a Sony product. They were right in that it was a better quality video box, but the prices remained higher in both the media and the players, so the majority of people stayed with and adopted VHS.

How about the music player wars? Sony is also a member of the RIAA and publishes such artists as Garth Brooks. There software would prevent you from ripping and copying copyrighted music, so when it came time to put your friend's mix cd in, the software refused it. The player and software lasted for such a short time, I can't recall the name.

And then there's the Bravia line of HDTV. While I must admit that the name and reputation of great television and video preceeds Sony; there's a little problem. Right now, people have accepted that they have to spend a lot on a quality HDTV.

There's no doubt that prices will fall in the ensuing months of 08, and as dumpsters fill with Cahode-Ray Tubes (CRT's), every TV and computer monitor will be replaced by a lighter, electrically efficient, chock-full-o-features flat-screens. As this happens, and the average household buys 4 or more TVs, the average consumer will begin to forget about needing the 'best' TV, and the market will bear more affordable 1080p's in the 40" and under size. This means that when given a choice between a 32" Bravia and a 32" VIZIO, the consumer will look for more than minor differences in quality for 150 to 200% price difference.

I'm not saying that the Bravia will die, but like any other super-high quality video or audio device before it, price will eventually be a deciding factor for many. There are those of us who don't care and would rather see a better quality picture than to pay 1/2 the $$; but the market tends to go in the other direction. Most of the people here are gamers, audiophiles, and videophiles. We wouldn't have bought a 360 if we weren't. But not all of us can afford the price tag on the Bravia line, plain and simple. Sony has tended to stand their ground on pricing, and it's doubtful that the Bravia TV's will follow suit with the rest of the market.

Pfft. One more reason for me to avoid giving Sony any business. I don't know what happened to them all the sudden, but lately it seems their management has been supplanted with some diabolical alien hive mind.

Besides, Samsung DLPs have a killer picture and are way more affordable...

You'd think that Sony would want to tap into the 360 owner's market. More people own 360s then PS3s. So show us 360 owners that if we won't buy your console, we should buy your TVs. Sounds like Sony is missing out on a large market for a very petty reason.

wow why are there sony fanboys posting on a website for a magazine about the 360. Hmmmm is it possible that they are jealous of the fact the ps3 has no good games, or is it just that they have so much free time on there hands due to the lack of a gaming experience that they get with there 500 blu-ray player

I recently purchased the Sony Bravia 52XBR4. It was either that or the Samsung 120Hz 52” model. I have owned a Samsung HDTV (1st Gen HDTV) in the past and was not happy with it‘s performance or the company‘s stance on backing it‘s product when it was blowing transceivers left and right. The Sony is by far the best TV I've owned. The day I brought it home I placed it in the designed cut out above my fireplace. I know all you heat fearing guys are yelling “why?!” or worse. Again this is a designed area for TV's and ventilation was considered and implemented into my house. As soon as I had the 360 hooked up to it I put in Casino Royale. The movie was incredible and this wasn’t even HD DVD or Blue-Ray, just the ol‘ XBOX 360! The sound was just as impressive. The first game played on it was COD 4, again amazing. Over the next year I will be adding either a HD DVD or a Blue-Ray player or both, and hooking them all up to a 7.1 surround sound system (the house was pre-wired for 7.1). If anyone is considering throwing down about $4,500 for a TV (that includes extended warranty and monster cable power box) I would strongly suggest they get this TV or even the smaller versions of this TV. If Sony was paying attention to sales, which they are, they would obviously see XBOX 360 stomping a proverbial “mud hole” in the Playstation 3, and opt to place adds with OXM or do the Hard Stuff column. If they don’t care then it’s just money, money that they would probably like to see in their quarterly reviews but won’t. Sorry Sony I was planning on buying a PS3 for the “just to have” but now I’m more confident than ever that XBOX and Microsoft will have my support and money (who I do have stocks with) from now on until Sony starts thinking outside the “BOX”. Oh yeah the Blue-Ray thing probably won’t happen for me unless “The Industry” swings to Blue-Ray only. What I would like to see in the Hard Stuff column is audio options.. Denon, Harmon Kardon, or Onkyo etc. Along with what speakers to put with them.

hey guys i'm really happy that sony made that decision. If you think about it sony dont need that extra money by selling hdtv with a xbox 360.you guys should find another brand sony only sells hdtv with ps3.anyways that money that the 360 will give to them.they only need to wait 2 years to be the # 1 console sold in the world.so xbox 360 fans fuck off and find your own brand tv because you guys will never see a package like a bravia hdtv and 360.so hopefully you guys will reconsidered a buy a ps3 that graphics look garte on the bravia tv.

To take Dan's point one step further, if they think that Dan would give an anti-Sony review, isn't he giving that review to what is percieved as an anti-Sony audience? What would they have to lose? If Dan gave the Bravia a poor review, would it be any worse than, oh, I don't know, say changing your competitor's wikipedia entries? Worst case scenario, Dan trashes it, and people who hate Sony products say "See, I told you so." Best case scenario (and the more likely) even a marginally favorable review would drive people not only to the Bravia, but to other Sony products. Let's be honest, the Bravia is not a cheap tv, but Sony makes great budget HDTV's as well. People go into the store, look at the Bravia that is placed next the Sony rear projection LCD. Boom. Increased sales. I don't get it either, it seems really like a knee jerk move for some reason.

Wow, cry me an effing river. I registered to post how lame this article was.

While I do have a nice plasma HDTV, if I did have to go out and buy a new HDTV, I would get the Sony Bravia XBR. The 120Hz makes that TV itself an unbelieveable product. 1080p isn't hard to find anymore, but that framerate is what is the selling point to me.

Sony wanting to "support" their sister company just seems to me like they'd like to sell their TVs without any "outside support" from a Microsoft-related magazine.

And most of you are right, Sony will still sells TONS of Bravias. But most people who are looking to upgrade their TVs to HD don't know where to start. And most people who own a 360 probably get their start by reading reviews in OXM.

And don't be fooled, OXM doesn't get the TV for free. They get it shipped to them to review, then that beautiful thing goes right back out to the manufacturer.

This is just Sony being Sony. Well...when it comes to Microsoft anyways.

well i guess that soney ain't gonna get my money. too bad microsoft isn't into making hdtv's themselves

Wait, so you just bought a bravia. Why don't you review your own. Bitter tears because Sony wouldn't give you a free tv. Lame, this website is garbage.

I would never expect a post this silly to get this many responses.

Sorry HDTV's, until I can get a nice one for $200, no one's getting my money.

Sony is getting their collective asses handed to them in the console war. Even if a few good games come out they loose so much money on each system it does not matter. Therefore, Sony has decided to resort to cheap tactics, and this is one of them.

CHECK IT: http://360live.blogspot.com/

It sounds to me like they very simply said no and didn't cause a huge disturbance about the siutation yet you draw countless conclusions due to being angry about the fact that you can't review the TV. They aren't losing money for doing this and they certainly didn't say anything along the lines of not wanting a customers money. Just let that shit go. Anyone who's smart that is buying an HDTV isn't gonna look at just one place for reviews, let alone your magazine by itself. Personally, if I were looking for an HD set I would not head over to OXM to find out what TV is the best. You are not the god of review, especially when it comes to HD sets. That sounds like a joke. Anyone who does look to one place for reviews MUST be a naive person.

Hey..Just get you sister Publication OPM to review the TV Set, you are all owned by Future Inc., anyway!

I'll wait for the Laser HDTV'S to come out next year. Sorry Sony...........

Like I said before, this may be a great opportunity for Sony to pass up, but its not a make or break deal for them. Their TV's will still be sold without any substantial hits barring a major boycott on Bravia sets. Maybe we are looking at this in terms of a "they don't like us Microsoft people" in the whole console war shindig.

Yea that's ridiculous, Sony is an electronics company first, game console maker second. If people would buy 360s then they would probably buy the Bravia to get such a great picture. We got a Bravia for my mom for mothers day and it was a little expensive but well worth it.
GT: Spybreaker
Now you're dead

Oh, I'm not refusing to review Bravias. Sony's declining to send us one. Our review offer stands, but they aren't interested in meeting with us at CES, so I don't have a lot of hope.

One point I'd disagree on: Reviewing a Bravia would not help sell 360s, as Wavy suggests. The people reading the magazine are, more often than not, already 360 owners -- that money is spent. Their TV money, however, isn't. If the review turned out to be positive, it wouldn't sell 360s, but it could help sell Bravias.

That, ultimately, is my point.

huh, that is odd. normally sony is a genius when comes to marketing and advertising. oh wait...

I think everyone is missing the point here. You say Dans post is childish I personally think sony denying a review because OXM reviews Microsoft products is childish. Should we go on to Asume that Sony dosent use a Microsoft operating system in there PC's, well thats simply not true. With that being said Sony themselves are suporting Microsoft. So denying a review loaner because of the console wars when it dosnt even pertain to the console wars themselves is indeed childish! Dan's response here atempts to convey that point not necesarily take a stab at sony. One more time for everyone that didn't catch it "Sony Uses Microsoft operating systems in there PC'S" So not wanting to send a review loaner in a hope to suport the PS3 is childish. So sony should go ahead and remove all there ties with Microsoft before they start denying TV's if they really think there tv's relate so much to the console war.

I can't believe anyone would turn down a free endorsement! I mean come on... Dan has already stated that he loves 'his' Bravia... so what does Sony have to lose? Sad.

Did you seriously think Sony would lend you a TV to help sell Xbox 360's? I suspect this was just a publicity stunt but its backfired becase its you that comes off looking stupid and childish considering you are now ruining any credibility you have by refusing to review some of the best TV's on the market.

The silliest part, here, is that OXM is owned by Future Publishing, which owns PSM (or whatever it's called), which, I'm pretty sure, has reviewed the Bravia. Sounds, to me, like biting the left hand because it's not the right. Sony is just being silly, here...

gt: cart00nstrip

And by posting an article with the headline "Sony doesn't want your money" you show your maturity. Congrats. "Your filthy Xbox 360 cables would only mess up its beautiful Bravias."? I see you don't know theres a such thing as the high road. You've invited readers to critique Sony, which is exactly along the lines of what Sony expected you to do. You played into their hands by doing what they knew you would do. Grow some balls and be an adult.

"You have no incentive to be truthful since there's no out-of-pocket expense. Catch my drift?"

Nonsense. if they aren't honest THE READERS STOP TRUSTING THEM. In today's world, reviewers cannot afford to be dishonest about a product. Seventy bajillion people will fact-check their asses before *breakfast*.

Buying a TV on the other hand can bias a review, as people tend to favor something they bought in order to justify the expense.

The response by the Sony rep. is ridiculous. I'm almost certain that this did not come down from a person in authority within the Sony PR group. The fact is the negative publicity generated by this story is almost certainly greater than the impact of a negative review in OXM.

Most Bravia buyers are going to do their homework and evaluate the purchase based on several factors, including reviews. To limit the customer base to a few selective reviews with potentially favorable publications is a very questionable practice and makes me question any Sony product review.

To further show how silly this is, despite the console battle between Sony and MS, they are partners in many other ventures, through various other divisions... Anyone seen a Sony computer lately??? Vista sure runs well on it, despite the "console war".

also dan if you do the review anyway make sure you send them a copy of the article so they know that the ppl heard exactly what they had to say about ms and ms customers

sony is a gompany of a**holes dan do the review anyway i mean u own a sony bravia so review that one besides it`d probaly some how come off as an insult to sony which is no less than they deserve i mean what kids company openly says they don`t want to affilate with ms cause they are competing against them hell it isn`t your magazines fault the ps3 sucks if they won`t allow a review do it anyway and make sure it`s noted whta they had to say on the matter tell ppl how sony does buisness also more reviews for 26 inch sets wouldn`t hurt plz review some samsung hdtv`s cause i don`t trust vizio